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  • #31
    Re: Monty visits the blokes....

    Well Gil....I thought that tea break thing was because the Guards Armoured were waiting for their Infantry before pushing on because with out them working in front they were blind and would likely have all been lost to German anti tank units that they had been having a running battle with since the start line. They took advantage and brewed. They did not halt 30 Corps to make tea. You know how it goes on the march. get fell out to sort out blisters and out comes the Hexi....
    It was Yanks that started that tea break stuff/rumour
    Tanks with no infantry are useless I was always led to believe.
    Last edited by trubrit2411; 26 July 2020, 12:33.
    "If they control your speech.....they control your life"
    Me


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    • #32
      Re: Monty visits the blokes....

      Absolutely correct, RE's sweeping for mines etc with troops to back them up. However, they could have made it had they overwhelmed their enemy and used the element of surprise, they had oodles of armour albeit, not a match for the Tiger had they met them on route. Their biggest foe was the 88. Rather than taking their time................easy to say from a computer chair 76 years on!!
      Last edited by Gil; 26 July 2020, 13:47.

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      • #33
        Re: Monty visits the blokes....

        Originally posted by Gil View Post
        I have always viewed Arnhem as "one that we didn't win".
        Yes I think ego's played a massive part in the battle right across the board, and there were some great leaders there who had very little say once the action started, topped with bad comms what else could go wrong.
        When XXX Corps should have pushed on regardless they stopped and enjoyed the sunshine and did in fact have their tea break as shown in the film its history and well recorded, as men of 2 PARA and other units who actually fulfilled their part of the bargain/operation fought bravely against the best Germany had, which weren't supposed to be anywhere near the place from up to the moment Intelligence briefs, and certainly before formations took off from England.
        I think it had been planned too far to stop the ball rolling, and they went anyway, regardless what the intelligence was telling them were occupying the town and surrounding areas!!

        Like many ops...........luck has so much to play in these things. Just think though, had it come off, millions would have been saved with the war ended early.
        Probably akin to the Iranian Embassy Siege, all the planning and training for that, and that was close to disaster too, had it not been for luck and the locations of the terrorists!

        And a very very strong balcony!!!

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        • #34
          Re: Monty visits the blokes....

          Originally posted by trubrit2411 View Post
          Well Gil....I thought that tea break thing was because the Guards Armoured were waiting for their Infantry before pushing on because with out them working in front they were blind and would likely have all been lost to German anti tank units that they had been having a running battle with since the start line. They took advantage and brewed. They did not halt 30 Corps to make tea. You know how it goes on the march. get fell out to sort out blisters and out comes the Hexi....
          It was Yanks that started that tea break stuff/rumour
          Tanks with no infantry are useless I was always led to believe.
          Do get a bit sick of the portrayal of the Brits in any Yank wartime film. On Bridge Too Far film the Brits were shown as signallers not giving a f**k for the crystal and not tested, then off for the brew, an intelligence officer cracking up and sent to the loony bin, the RAF according to the Polish general felt the RAF should be in the German forces, ignoring panzers near to Arnhem, some f***in idiot general giving it Guards with cravats and the attack was 'like the cowboys riding to save them from the Indians' and all that crap. This has gone on since WW2 and WW1. Errol Flynn recaptured Burma, the Yanks captured an Kraut Enigma (?) machine which saved the world. You can either laugh at it or cry FFS!

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          • #35
            Re: Monty visits the blokes....

            Pat,
            This was done for me by John Ward of 16 PARA Lincoln who was a damn good artist, he later went on to do the pictures in BING The Parschuting Dog and Mertyl The Parachuting chicken, both books to raise money for the museum. He was an absolute gent and a great friend no longer with us.
            He knew my aversion to all those that said they were on the balcony, and didn't realise I knew each of them that actually were there that day, with only Mel Parry left. Mac died in 2011 after his son was killed in Afghanistan and it affected him badly.....nuff said!
            Enjoy the piece which I have put up before, it sits in my office in pride of place and a great piece to ALL those Walters out there who wish they coudl walk in these mens shadows!!

            Titles: WHO WAS DARE WINS
            Attached Files

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            • #36
              Re: Monty visits the blokes....

              Originally posted by Gil View Post
              Pat,
              This was done for me by John Ward of 16 PARA Lincoln who was a damn good artist, he later went on to do the pictures in BING The Parschuting Dog and Mertyl The Parachuting chicken, both books to raise money for the museum. He was an absolute gent and a great friend no longer with us.
              He knew my aversion to all those that said they were on the balcony, and didn't realise I knew each of them that actually were there that day, with only Mel Parry left. Mac died in 2011 after his son was killed in Afghanistan and it affected him badly.....nuff said!
              Enjoy the piece which I have put up before, it sits in my office in pride of place and a great piece to ALL those Walters out there who wish they coudl walk in these mens shadows!!

              Titles: WHO WAS DARE WINS
              Bit of Artistic License ther Gil - that balcony is way too small to hold half the people I have met who said they were on it at the time.....
              I just don't understand why they won't shut the hell up while I practice my people skills....

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              • #37
                Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                Think the blokes that took part in the Embassy siege, were brilliant team players and certainly deserve the accolades the received about the operation afterwards, just a pity that bloke Middleton, didn't follow the same vein !
                Bob (geordie) Watts

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                • #38
                  Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                  Dunt arf big iz sen up that kunt Bob.

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                  • #39
                    Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                    Originally posted by bob9739 View Post
                    Think the blokes that took part in the Embassy siege, were brilliant team players and certainly deserve the accolades the received about the operation afterwards, just a pity that bloke Middleton, didn't follow the same vein !
                    Bob, there were 2 Sqn lads that i know of on that job, John Sparham and Gerry Bonnar, Gerry's in this picture.

                    Gerry Bonnar.jpg
                    Last edited by Don the Mod; 27 July 2020, 17:54.
                    "We're surrounded on all sides... Good... you're obviously in the right place".

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                    • #40
                      Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                      Rusty Firmin on theer wuz an ace footy player, n Sheff Utd at one time offered ta buy im out n sign im up.

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                      • #41
                        Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                        Originally posted by Gil View Post
                        There you go a real soldier in the correct kit with a maroon machine. Downloading images works for me
                        Gil , I was in Maida for a couple of months before demob in 64, mate of mine Jock Tait was the CO,s driver, used to pick Monty up ,at Camberley on the weekends n bring him to the Depot Officers mess, met him a couple o times

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                        • #42
                          Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                          It was a great honour to get his briefing trailer and staff car at Duxford where it now sits in the Land Warfare hanger at the bottom of the airfield. aCertainly worth a visit. His drivers are all listed there.

                          I have often wondered whether he met Rommels like minded batman/driver and swapped shit. Now there's a tale!!

                          When this COVID-19 crap is over, be nice for the BAFC to hold an annual event at Duxford. Two big hotels in the area and one being built on the airfield soon.............just a thought, The Museum is there and lots of stuff we have including the VC's in the Museum Archive and other stuff never shown only to a few!!
                          Could be a central place for many to gather and the railway line to Chesterford, is right by the boozer too!!
                          Last edited by Gil; 28 July 2020, 18:01.

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                          • #43
                            Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                            Sounds like a plan Gil👍
                            It's not the dog in the fight,it's the fight in the dog that matters.

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                            • #44
                              Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                              Originally posted by Gil View Post
                              It was a great honour to get his briefing trialer and staff car at Duxford where it now sits in the Land Warfare hanger at the bottom of the airfield. aCertainly worth a visit. His drivers are all listed there.

                              I have often wondered whether he met Rommels like minded batman/driver and swapped shit. Now there's a tale!!

                              When this COVID-19 crap is over, be nice for the BAFC to hold an annual event at Duxford. Two big hotels in the area and one being built on the airfield soon.............just a thought, The Museum is there and lots of stuff we have including the VC's in the Museum Archive and other stuff never shown only to a few!!
                              Could be a central place for many to gather and the railway line to Chesterford, is right by the boozer too!!
                              On me list
                              "If they control your speech.....they control your life"
                              Me


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                              • #45
                                Re: Monty visits the blokes....

                                Speaking to Don about it, down to the Committee, but we could easily do VIP visits and show stuff that would not normally be accessible due to age and wear, also put on some cracking displays, sniper rifles/Clothing etc and some visits to behind the scenes building of Spitfires and other really beautiful craft in the process of being resurrected.
                                It is a 3 day visit the whole site without us at one end and the middle ground at building 213 on the North side.
                                Thats why I think it would be a great ABF weekend, and could fit in with 16 Air Assaults weekend when they do a big show!!
                                Leave it with the headshed to consider, but the offers there and there are a few on here who are volunteers at the museum too...........finally get to meet them.

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